Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by jeromef1 » Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:55 am

Don't worry guys, we all know that it wasn't intentional! I will have a look with the stewards team tonight or tomorrow 😊
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Fmontini » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:08 am

Kenny Duval wrote: That one is not gonna get blamed on me. There was plenty of room and however unfortunate I would have given you the next corner.

Kenny be honest. upload the video from 30 seconds before when in the oval you could have let me through. instead, you decided to leave space
 on the most dangerous turn of the circuit and outside. Come on be honest
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Kenny Duval » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:14 am

What good would that do as I still wouldn't be on the racing line? You had plenty of room. But since you asked for it.

Last edited by Kenny Duval on Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Phyrexius » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:26 am

Fmontini wrote:
Kenny Duval wrote: That one is not gonna get blamed on me. There was plenty of room and however unfortunate I would have given you the next corner.

Kenny be honest. upload the video from 30 seconds before when in the oval you could have let me through. instead, you decided to leave space
 on the most dangerous turn of the circuit and outside. Come on be honest
I'm gonna be honest with you here Francisco. The Daytona instance you cannot put any blame on Kenny at all. What is the #1 rule of racing? "It is the responsibility of the overtaking driver to ensure the pass is made cleanly and safely" Kenny has no obligation to give you any line as he is in his own race. Sure it's courteous if the person being lapped lifts off a bit to let you by, but it is by no means a requirement. That spin was entirely your fault, Kenny had nothing to do with it. 
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Fmontini » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:46 am

Phyrexius wrote:
Fmontini wrote:
Kenny Duval wrote: That one is not gonna get blamed on me. There was plenty of room and however unfortunate I would have given you the next corner.

Kenny be honest. upload the video from 30 seconds before when in the oval you could have let me through. instead, you decided to leave space
 on the most dangerous turn of the circuit and outside. Come on be honest
I'm gonna be honest with you here Francisco. The Daytona instance you cannot put any blame on Kenny at all. What is the #1 rule of racing? "It is the responsibility of the overtaking driver to ensure the pass is made cleanly and safely" Kenny has no obligation to give you any line as he is in his own race. Sure it's courteous if the person being lapped lifts off a bit to let you by, but it is by no means a requirement. That spin was entirely your fault, Kenny had nothing to do with it. 
This video is out of context. I know is my foult and that is why no report Kenny. But Kenny could let me pass in a very much secure place. He only show one part of that...not 30 seconds before
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by MrCaringi » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:48 am

Right now I dont want to say anything about the incident, I think I have nothing valuable to add; We should trust on the stewards, I think they will be impartial and fair.

But, I got some doubts about what Benjamin says:
Phyrexius wrote: ... Kenny has no obligation to give you any line as he is in his own race. Sure it's courteous if the person being lapped lifts off a bit to let you by, but it is by no means a requirement.

This is a very interesting point of view, I would like to get a clarification because I didnt understand the same after reading the rule 10.1 :
    10. Being Lapped
  1. As soon as a driver is caught by another driver who is about to lap him, the driver who is about be lapped must allow the lapping driver past at the first available opportunity. He must do this safely, and with minimal disruption. He should be predictable, and he shouldn’t brake hard or quickly change his racing line.
So, I had given plenty of space when I got lapped (which happeds very often to me :D ), but It seems like there is not necessary to do that.

Thanks in advance.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Kenny Duval » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:56 am

Look I want to earn every point I get on the track. I don't want to get a position by intentionally spinning anyone. I get why he felt the need to protest I do. I think if you review the race however and look at his car position in that corner for the previous 11 laps I think you'll find the error was made on corner entry on lap 12 and he was a little wide. in trying to bring the car back to the racing line he was just a little later getting to the throttle and unfortunately I had a better line and a better exit. Those 2 things lead to contact. If his car positon was the same as the previous laps at the apex I would have called it a bump and run on myself immediately. We'll let race control review it and I'll take my lumps if that's the decision.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Pittenger5 » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:56 am

Whoops, I done fucked up regarding the blue flags rules too. 
Last edited by Pittenger5 on Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Kenny Duval » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:58 am

MrCaringi wrote: Right now I dont want to say anything about the incident, I think I have nothing valuable to add; We should trust on the stewards, I think they will be impartial and fair.

But, I got some doubts about what Benjamin says:
Phyrexius wrote: ... Kenny has no obligation to give you any line as he is in his own race. Sure it's courteous if the person being lapped lifts off a bit to let you by, but it is by no means a requirement.

This is a very interesting point of view, I would like to get a clarification because I didnt understand the same after reading the rule 10.1 :
    10. Being Lapped
  1. As soon as a driver is caught by another driver who is about to lap him, the driver who is about be lapped must allow the lapping driver past at the first available opportunity. He must do this safely, and with minimal disruption. He should be predictable, and he shouldn’t brake hard or quickly change his racing line.
So, I had given plenty of space when I got lapped (which happeds very often to me :D ), but It seems like there is not necessary to do that.

Thanks in advance.
Giving room and making it a little easier on the passing driver is fine. You just want to avoid abrupt line changes and over zealous braking to make that happen.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Phyrexius » Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:04 pm

MrCaringi wrote: Right now I dont want to say anything about the incident, I think I have nothing valuable to add; We should trust on the stewards, I think they will be impartial and fair.

But, I got some doubts about what Benjamin says:
Phyrexius wrote: ... Kenny has no obligation to give you any line as he is in his own race. Sure it's courteous if the person being lapped lifts off a bit to let you by, but it is by no means a requirement.

This is a very interesting point of view, I would like to get a clarification because I didnt understand the same after reading the rule 10.1 :
    10. Being Lapped
  1. As soon as a driver is caught by another driver who is about to lap him, the driver who is about be lapped must allow the lapping driver past at the first available opportunity. He must do this safely, and with minimal disruption. He should be predictable, and he shouldn’t brake hard or quickly change his racing line.
So, I had given plenty of space when I got lapped (which happeds very often to me :D ), but It seems like there is not necessary to do that.

Thanks in advance.
My apologies, I actually didn't realize PRL had their own rules on being lapped. I was assuming they were using the iRacing sporting code for that. In that case, ignore what I posted. 
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Fmontini » Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:33 pm

Kenny Duval wrote: What good would that do as I still wouldn't be on the racing line? You had plenty of room. But since you asked for it.

Only shows 5 seconds until turn 1.  But kenny that race is in the past.  I asume my part. In Suzuka you hit me and you do nothing to avoid the colision. 
If you see my race behind Nick you will see that many could hit it but I brake to avoid it (in chicane for example)
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Kenny Duval » Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:42 pm

How far back should I go to make you happy Francisco? Clearly you were closing. Clearly I noticed it and did my best to give enough room. I'm not sure rewinding to the first half of that lap would make the outcome or the perception of what happened any different.

I'm also not sure there was anything I could have done differently at Suzuka. I mean if it was my intention to take you out I could have just not touched the brakes on the flat part of the turn or clobbered you entering the hair pin.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by jeromef1 » Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:49 pm

Ok guys, let's move on. Daytona and Suzuka incidents are totally different.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by MrCaringi » Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:58 pm

Guys, calm down please.
There is no point in keep arguing about it.

Lets wait for the stewards resolution.
Giving room and making it a little easier on the passing driver is fine. You just want to avoid abrupt line changes and over zealous braking to make that happen.
That was my toughts Kenny, thanks.
My apologies, I actually didn't realize PRL had their own rules on being lapped. I was assuming they were using the iRacing sporting code for that. In that case, ignore what I posted.
It's OK Benjamin, I just wanted to be sure... in anyway, I cant even see you when you lap me hehehehehe.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by DeamingPie » Wed Jan 31, 2018 1:42 pm

Not that my opinion matters and not to stir the pot, but I'm not exactly sure what Kenny could have differently. Fmontini was wide going into the turn, Kenny was not. It did not appear that Kenny was going for a pass either. Fmontini attempted to cut back over to the apex after running wide, which I don't believe Kenny was expecting. If Fmontini would have stayed to the outside I believe Kenny would have left him room upon his exit from the corner. From the time Fmontini came back over to apex, there was little to no time for Kenny to react. Too much brake on that corner and the car washes away (at least with my set up). I am uncertain if Kenny even lifted the throttle if that would have avoided the contact by the time he realized what was happening.

Like I said, I am not trying to stir the pot or point fingers. I believe having civil discussions about incidents like this helps everyone (and I'm not implying this discussion is uncivil either). The more we can learn from our mistakes and the mistakes of others the better we become.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Ozymandias » Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:40 pm

I just reviewed the incident of Francisco and Kenny in Suzuka . It strikes me that, after hitting Francisco, Kenny goes wide at the exit of the curve. If Kenny tried to take the inside with another turning radius then he lost the braking point and took the corner too fast. The other option is that despite seeing Francisco ahead, he did nothing to avoid the contact and continued to accelerate. If you hit other car usually your speed is reduced but here Kenny goes very wide (4  wheels outside the track) at the exit of the spoon.
Of course nobody says it was intentional. As Erik says, we can learn about this for future races.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by Kenny Duval » Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:54 pm

No..that's the line I had chosen I just wasn't expecting Francisco to still be there. They were killing me off that corner most laps.
Last edited by Kenny Duval on Wed Jan 31, 2018 3:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Round 8: Suzuka International Racing Course - Grand Prix (Jan 30)

Post by wings19 » Wed Jan 31, 2018 3:01 pm

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